dibble bar

Discussion in 'Deer Management, Habitat & Conservation' started by citybowhunter, Jun 2, 2009.

  1. citybowhunter

    citybowhunter Senior Member

    Feb 13, 2009
    Independence Mo.
    I'm starting to understand what a dibble bar is and how it works and how to use it effectively.
    What do you think about going out and spraying roundup in myvfescue field (round circles every where i want to plant a seedling) and coming back when it's time to plant the seedlings and planting into the yellowed/dead grass?
     
  2. Gamegetter

    Gamegetter Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2004
    I would wait to spray until about 15 days before I was planning on planting the trees. That would be my guess anyway, I'm sure a more knowledgeable tree and/or chemical expert will let me know if I'm way off base.
     

  3. pinwheel

    pinwheel Jenny's Lackey

    Jun 17, 2006
    middle of nowhere
    Very short term solution. Long term planting into fescue would be some sort of weed mat, like land scape cloth if you're just planting a few trees.

    Rule I always heard for planting trees was any month with an R in it's spelling was a good time to plant a tree.
     
  4. brushpile

    brushpile New Member

    Feb 23, 2008
    Springfield, MO
    I agree w/Pinwheel about the month with an "R" in it. Unless you will be watering your trees, it's too late to plant. The next best time will be when trees go dormant in the Fall.

    Dibble Bars were invented for planting large volumes of small seedlings with short roots, like tiny pine seedlings. Most trees have roots too large for a dibble bar. I recommend a shovel over a dibble bar, so that the roots are spread out into a planting hole, rather than stuffed into a dibble bar openning. I guarantee that seedlings have better survival rates, and are healthier trees, when their roots are properly planted.

    A dibble bar pokes a 6-8 inch openning. If a tree has 12-18 inches of roots, they either get cut to size, or stuffed in the hole. The result is J rooting, and high mortality. A lot of trees get planted in a hurry, and most of them die in a hurry.

    What kind of trees are you planting?
     
  5. citybowhunter

    citybowhunter Senior Member

    Feb 13, 2009
    Independence Mo.
    i should have been more clear. i'm done planting trees this year i was considering the dibble bar for next year. it seems the limiting factor on how many trees i plant is time and effort. it sounded like the dibble bar could speed up the process and make things much easier. so far i've planted 50 hybrid poplar cuttings and 25 pin oaks. i don't know yet what i'll be planting next year.
     
  6. TOBRYAN

    TOBRYAN Well-Known Member

    Dec 4, 2002
    Liberty, Mo
    IMO!

    Ive had better luck planting in fescue with a dibble than spraying roundup.
    The weeds after spraying come up taller and more vigorous than the low mat of fescue.
     
  7. letemgrow

    letemgrow Well-Known Member

    I spray the fescue long before I go to plant the seedlings. My spraying has already started for this fall and next spring. I have a dibble bar, but do not use it for one simple reason. Some seedlings has bigger root systems than the dibble bar can provide hole wise. With the sod killed the soil digs up easily with a spade. I go that route so I can spread out the roots of the seedlings and not bunch them into the hole.

    I will spray the spots 2-3 times a year so it is bare ground and keep it that way the first few years until the seedlings can handle their own. TO is right, if you only spray once you can make things worse since the weeds can grow taller than the seedling pretty quickly. A few weeds tho can hide them from a deer where as an open grown seedling can have a bullseye on them if they are not protected.
     
  8. brushpile

    brushpile New Member

    Feb 23, 2008
    Springfield, MO
  9. pinwheel

    pinwheel Jenny's Lackey

    Jun 17, 2006
    middle of nowhere
    [rquote=1284823&tid=89862&author=citybowhunter]i should have been more clear. i'm done planting trees this year i was considering the dibble bar for next year. it seems the limiting factor on how many trees i plant is time and effort. it sounded like the dibble bar could speed up the process and make things much easier. so far i've planted 50 hybrid poplar cuttings and 25 pin oaks. i don't know yet what i'll be planting next year.
    [/rquote]

    Dibble bar works great for bare root trees IMO. I've planted between 500-1000 trees this way & have had great success with them surviving. My best advice though would be to use it when the soil is borderline too wet, rather than dry. Don't be afraid to make a double width hole & woller the hole to accomidate the roots if you've got trees with big roots.
     
  10. brushpile

    brushpile New Member

    Feb 23, 2008
    Springfield, MO
    Pinwheel, how do you get a foot or more of tree roots down a 6-8 inch dibble bar hole, that narrows toward the bottom:confused: I don't know if I wasn't dibbling properly, or just not wollering enough.:rof2:
     
  11. HabitatMD

    HabitatMD Active Member

    Jan 4, 2007
    St. Louis, Mo
    Its perfectly acceptable to trim roots.
     
  12. brushpile

    brushpile New Member

    Feb 23, 2008
    Springfield, MO
    Tttttttttttttttttttttrim roots.:eek::eek::eek:
     
  13. letemgrow

    letemgrow Well-Known Member

    If the roots are trimmed, I would trim the tops too. I only trim roots if they are too deep for me to plant. I will dig holes 2 foot deep and trim any roots that are deeper. Just be sure to trim up the tops too so the roots can support them.

    Here is a chokecherry that I trimmed the tops and roots to match. It has put on a good 18-20" now. This pic is a few weeks old.

    [​IMG]
     
  14. HabitatMD

    HabitatMD Active Member

    Jan 4, 2007
    St. Louis, Mo
    We used the 1/3 rule on ours. Don't trim more than 1/3 of the root system. Our results don't lie...well, except for the deciduous holly.
     
  15. pinwheel

    pinwheel Jenny's Lackey

    Jun 17, 2006
    middle of nowhere
    [rquote=1285036&tid=89862&author=brushpile]Pinwheel, how do you get a foot or more of tree roots down a 6-8 inch dibble bar hole, that narrows toward the bottom:confused: I don't know if I wasn't dibbling properly, or just not wollering enough.:rof2:[/rquote]

    You need a different dibble bar I guess. Mine punches a 12" deep hole. By double holing for big roots, you can L the roots. Do not J the roots. By turning them sideways in the hole, they'll turn themselves down. As for trimming roots, what I was told was you do no harm at all triming the hair roots. On the false indigo we planted last spring, we had to trim several of the main roots. We haven't lost a single one of them that I'm aware of & we planted 250 of them. Course, they're super easy to grow.
     
  16. brushpile

    brushpile New Member

    Feb 23, 2008
    Springfield, MO
    Ahhh, I see! The dibble bar the MDC lent me had an 8" blade. I found it impossible to use, but a 12" Dibble Bar in wet ground sounds much better.

    I don't doubt that seedlings will grow if the roots are trimmed, but I want rapid growth, and deep roots to survive the Summer. So I dig holes for my trees. Habitat, my Deciduous Holly is barely creeping along, and even though mine survived, I won't be planting anymore. They are both difficult and slow to grow.
     
  17. letemgrow

    letemgrow Well-Known Member

    If anyone is high on the dibble bars I have one to sell since I can achieve the same process as a dibble with a good square shovel after I kill the sod so the ground is easily worked. :D